Transcript of US Envoy On Peace Deal That Could Change the Middle East Forever...

[Music] Mr. Ambassador, it's an absolute pleasure, sir. It's great catching up with you. I'm a great fan. I appreciate it and um I'm going to jump straight into it because I've been looking for the forward for this conversation for a very long time. I think there's two conflicts um right now that are extremely complex to solve. One is Ukraine and one one is the Middle East, Gaza, Syria, Iran, Israel, Lebanon. Most people don't know that what's happening in the Middle East is decades and decades in the making. And you're now in a position where you're trying to end that. you know those decades of war and suffering very very complex and difficult position. My first question to you sir is is how how did you end up here? I think fate and and destiny is the the simple answer and the more complex answer is is is the president of the United States happened to be a friend of mine and as such a great fan of of Lebanon and Lebanon history since I'm the byproduct of of both cultures and he and I kind of grew up in business together. So along that road, I I had always told him that whatever tiny modicum of success I had compared to his was as a result of the intersection of this amazing DNA that came from the Levant, which I couldn't explain. I grew up in a tiny working-class neighborhood in America along with American freedom and I never understood what what flame that was. Why did why did Lebanese and Syrians and people from the Levant have this ability to go anywhere in the world and create an oasis in the desert? And and it was always uh on my mind. Later in life, I I I found out. And when President Trump took his his his second term, you know, I had been running a New York Stock Exchange company. I retired. I went through my own political hell uh after the the first term and he said, "Why don't you stay with me?" And I said, "Because I'm not interested in being a heel clicking, cork sniffing ambassador. My life is fortunate enough without having to do that." And you know, there's only one thing that really interests me because I'm in the last chapter of my relevant life. I've been blessed from from nothing to something because of great parents and the ability to have this internal fire. And I would love if I could to chip away with you, if you're open to it, Mr. President, and find how do we merge these very complicated lanes onto a highway of final tolerance and understanding and acceptance. And I know that's the most difficult road you have in front of you. But fortunately, I don't need a job. I'm not a politician. I'm kind of an eventdriven mercenary diplomat. And if you allow me the opportunity, let me try and chip away. That was really what what brought me here. What was his response? Wouldn't you rather go to St. Barts or Paris? I wouldn't be surprised if saying that. as the same thing, right? You know, I mean, he's look, he's so good in his instincts are so good. And he said, I get it. That's a really tough task. I want peace and prosperity in that region, which he's, you know, which he's done. And so, he gave me the the opportunity to do it quite honestly. And I'd done business, you know, for 40 years in the region. So, you you think that you understand it. And we, you know, we we come from this blood. You think that you have that ability to be able to connect and I understood the other side of it, but quite honestly, you have no idea how difficult it is to expune regrets of the past, right? When you have the lack of nation states in our region in the broad middle east and we talk about Sykes Pico and what you know what the British and the French did in in 1919 and just drawing these lines but before that it makes sense right and you you have individuals that worry about individuals then what do they worry about they worry about their family and after family what do they worry about they worry about tribe and after tribe they worry about village and after village nation states weren't created until the 199 00s. So when you talk about any of these places and what they've been through, the torturous tribal rivalries that they've all had very difficult to meld and say we've had centuries of this identifying ourselves as an ethnic group, as a tribe, as a village. We've had sons that have been killed by our neighbors. We've had fathers that we've lost. We've had mothers and daughters that uh have gone through these obliterations. So to walk in the door in one day and say, "Oh, by the way, we're going to do a great new program. You're going to love this new map." It doesn't happen that way. So I've I've been getting an education, not in diplomacy, but in aligning expectations. The the humbling effect of the fact that everybody wants peace. I haven't in in these difficult countries, I haven't honestly had a dialogue or an intersection with any group, any faction, any individual who didn't claim and I really believe underneath it that that they want peace. But peace seems to be an illusion. You you have you have to have foundation stones in order to get to peace. And that's always the problem is h how do you get there? H can you tell me more about these discussions behind the scenes because you've met the prime minister of Israel Netanyahu. You've met the Lebanese president, you've met um Nabi who's an ally to his and some see him as a de facto representative. You've met the Syrian president al-Shara. So you've just met all these different individuals, enemies, rivals. um and rivals, not recent rivals, but rivals for decades. Can you tell me more about these behind the-scenes meetings with all these individuals? You kind of hinted that they all want peace, which is beautiful to hear. Um what were the biggest difficulties or hurdles you faced in those discussions? So, first of all, let me let me put it in into perspective. I I I think I have a unique ability because I I I I started in the region as a as a as as a young finance. I must have been the worst lawyer by the way in the entire firm because they sent me to Saudi Arabia when I was 23. And at that time there were no roads, there were no there was no nothing. But I sat in the Melus at night in a dialect that I didn't understand in a country that nobody understood at the time and I learned more probably quantitatively than I ever did which was about listening to different points of view and understanding how in that mus a Bedawin prince or leader would listen to his constituency who had a water problem who had a camel problem on one side and we're building $300 million ports, hydrocarbon factories, gas liquefification plants on the other side. It was like it was like a wonder. So I learned that, you know, my destiny was not that my destiny was to be an usher along the road and taking those points of view and melding them with other points of view. And I built a business out of that. I built a business out of never having a theme but creating opportunities between this intersection where people don't understand each other. Where could you find that? So in dealing with the current leaders, I've watched them all grow in to their positions and and I'll give you a specific specificity because everybody's interested in really what is the what is the chemistry. So let me start with I'll start with O'Sar. Everybody's first question to me is how is it possible that you can take an El-Nusra Sunni fundamentalist soldier warrior chief and with a magic wand all of a sudden he becomes president of one of the most important countries in the region and do you trust him? Do you believe that? So I I'll start with the conclusion so that I don't have to torture anybody to listen to me to get there. The answer is yes. I trust him. I believe him. I'm certain that his objectives today are aligned with our objectives. What are those objectives? create a new fabric of understanding, regional understanding in the region itself and bring Syria back on a new path to prosperity, stability, security. And by the way, everybody, every constituency around him is trying to interfere with that happening. So as an individual, he comes into power, he has an idea, he ran Idlib, he has a small team, and he's got a bunch of foreign fighters. So what what's it like? It's like the West saying, "By the way, I have eight dramatic conditions. This is the West saying for me to believe them." And they they marched through them. Join the Abraham Accords. Get rid of the foreign fighters, get rid of the chemical weapon. I mean, it's it's a series of things that if you had 15 years in process with 500,000 people in an unlimited budget, you could get it done. This young man walks into Damascus one day, surprisingly takes out a 14-year regime, and has a bastion of followers that he came from Idlib with who are now overwhelmed with a plethora of problems, not only inside, right? So, we know about El Swiden and we talk about the Drews and we talk about the Bedawins and we talk about the Elawites. We talk about the atrocities in the church and we have the PKK and the YPG. Every three-letter acronym, every threeletter acronym hates me at the moment, right? So, I stay away from three letters. I try and go to the four-letter acronyms that will embrace me. So, he's trying and what did President Trump do? Sanctions are a huge issue because forget about peace. You need prosperity first. How do you get prosperity? You have to turn on an economy. The Syrian people are hardworking, industrious, wonderful, hospitable people that are looking for an answer. And we have refugees everywhere. We have three and a half million in Turkey. We have a million and a half in Jordan. You you have a million and a half in Lebanon. all wanting to go back. But you don't have a banking system. You don't have a central bank. They have these hoalas, a barter system. They have three days a week of water. They have four hours a day of of power. They can't find food. They can't get money from the diaspora. I mean, this is not a simple problem, but where they live on hope. So, he walks in, he has a small band of people. We're giving him all these requirements. President Trump comes up on May 10th, May 11th. NBS brilliantly flies Elshara over. President Trump was well briefed on all the issues. So he knew what both sides have been telling him about. Do you unwrap these sanctions? Do you not unwrap the sanctions? And he made the right decision. He said there's no chance. We have no plan B in Syria. If Syria falls again, the counterterrorism threat from ISIS, from Iran, from all of the things that we're confronting, from Hezbollah, from Hamas, from the Houthis is going to be unbelievably dramatic. I'm going to give him a chance. And he did. So now the rest of the world is around him. The Gulf is helping. Traa is helping. Jordan is is is helping. The relationship with Lebanon is tenuous because the Lebanese are not certain what his agenda is. I'll come back to that. And Israel. So he's got all the inside problems which are the Drews are saying, "I want Drews land." The Kurds are saying, "I want Kursland." Elites are saying, "I want Elawite land." And he's saying, "I want a centralized Syrian government." Right? These these federal programs have not worked well. So lessons from the past and regime change. By the way, the president wasn't responsible for regime change in Syria. It wasn't him that caused this. And his lessons learned in the past has been since 1948, we've probably had 10 regime changes that people can attribute to the United States. None of them have worked. They don't work. So, we spent $3 trillion in Iraq. It's a mess. We go in and out of Afghanistan. It's a mess. We go in and out of Libya, say Gaddafu. We don't like him coming with his camels to New York and tying them to the Statue of Liberty. Get somebody new. It doesn't work. So, this president is saying no regime change, no more boots on the ground. We'll usher to help get this done, but you, the rest of the regional community, need to help. And that's what's happening. So, he's resource constrained. He has inside problems. inside problems are how do you align these minorities so that they can participate in this new centralized regional government. It takes time. So you have missteps and mistakes along the way. You don't have a highly trained elite military. You don't have resources because the sanctions really haven't come on yet. You don't have a team. So you have to borrow teams from everybody. And in the meantime, all of the adversarial disturbers to whomse benefit ignores not having a stable Syria are doing everything they can to disrupt. So my view, do you mind if I ask Do you mind if I ask who those are? Sorry, interrupt. Do you mind if I ask who those parties are that don't want stability in Syria? Not sure if you could. So yeah, so Iran being number one, right? Iran is a stated enemy of the United States. They have proxies, Hezbollah, Hamas, Houthis, and others. They're still being funded. You know, we we talk about sanctions holding them accountable. Israel did. President Trump heroically weighed in. I mean, that was that was an amazing realignment. When we're talking about the Middle East and regional power, that that was a moment, right? Right? You have the president of United States talking about peace and prosperity, having power as the as the overlay, right? As the as the cloud which was always there but not utilized and in a brilliant and surgical way rebalanced that peace, prosperity and power with no collateral damage. But you better take him seriously. But we still have Iran to deal with. Israel is dealing with Iran. We still have ISIS. When you say, you know, the next question to me in dealing with all of these individuals is, you know, what the hell are you doing? What what is America doing? What why should America be in the middle of any of this? The answer is simple. Besides humanitarian issues we've been through after World War II, we tried to be the security guarantor of the world. We tried. We had a Marshall plan. We had GAT. We got free seas, free trade all over the world. Different model today saying we're no longer the security guarantor of the world. Everybody has to stand up for themselves. It's not just it's not America first to the to the detriment of the rest of the world. It's America first and everybody gather their own crowd around them and let's figure out how we put them back together. But America not intervening in these countries and disturbing the natural balance of things is only one main reason. Counterterrorism. How do we protect America from the flood of fundamental terrorist action which unfortunately has had the backdrop on a warm and benevolent and soft Islam. Right? Islam is not the enemy. Fundamental terrorists come in all flavors from every place. But the patina on it has been particularly out of the Middle East. In the Far East come these enemy combatants and they come in cells. And who are they being financed by? Where do they get their weapons? I mean, it's amazing. As I as I've gone down as I've gone down the the hole in really trying to understand this, it's just incredible how money comes from all of these fction factions to upset the neighbor for their own purposes. So you see what's happening for instance against uh Russian oil with a great country an ally like India but we we can't stop the process if you don't turn off the tap of where the money is coming from. So it's all of these all of these cells that have an interest to upset in Alshara's position. Remember another thing, you have Turkey who is an ally of Syria. They have PKK which again is a stated foreign terrorist organization within Turkey. The US also has claimed the PKK as a foreign terrorist organization. There is a another organization which is no longer affiliated with PKK SDF and YPG which have been our allies and a deisis campaign. Their their genealogy was out of PKK. So you have the Kurds in the northeast. That's them. That's SDF. You have the Drews and the Bedawins in the south. And the and the Drews, the Syrian Drews are related to the Israeli Drews. So just to give you an idea of the complexity, why I have a three Tylenol headache every night. Do they trust do they trust each other's intention though? So that when you say because when there were clashes between the the the uh government supporters, I think there were Sunni supporters with the Drews in the north. Israel got involved in a struck inside Damascus. I think he was a one of the headquarters, government headquarters in support of the Jews. So when you talk to the Syrian president, does he trust Israel's intentions? Does he believe that Israel wants peace in Syria or is there some either himself or within his government that think that Israel wants to sow, you know, civil unrest in Syria to keep the country weak? I know many in in the Arab world do believe that as well. I can only give you my impression, my point of view, right? You you have to have you ask ask him that question, he'll give you the answer. Let me give you my impression. Is no. He doesn't trust their intentions. Nobody trusts their intentions. Right? What's going on in Gaza makes the rest of the Arab world totally freaked out because no matter how you look at it after October 7th, the world for Israel has changed. Their notion of what their mandate is and what are borders and boundaries and lines has changed. So I think it's safe to say in Israel's mind these lines these lines that were created by Sykes Pico are meaningless. They will go where they want when they want and do what they want to protect the Israelis and their border to make sure October 7th never happens again. Full stop there. Elshara is a pragmatist. So he's looking what Israel did in coming across those lines stated purpose to protect the Drews nervous about Elshara's military moving down the M5 the main road from Damascus to Elite Iluis in the south taking out those convoys and then going to Damascus as kind of a a little teaser saying by the way just so you know how vulnerable you are if you don't listen to us, we can not only take out your defense building, we can take out the palace. Pragmatically now saying, I hear you. We have two roads. He's a warrior. Are you going to go to battle with Israel? Not a good idea. Hasn't fared well for anybody. And you have America as an ally to Israel. Can he go to the Abraham Accords? No way. He has a fundamentalist backing of Sunni fundamentalists who liken Lebanon, right? When you mention the word Israel to a lot of factions in Lebanon, they freak out. I have the same discussion with them. I said, "Guys, get over it. It's Jurassic Park. You either either talk to him today or you're going to talk to him in three years from now or five years from now. You have dialogue is all that matters." So, Elshara is running to a dialogue. We've now had two meetings, historic meetings. They haven't talked for 30 years. And I have to tell you, it blew my mind. I I sat we we brought them to to Paris and the French have been very helpful to us in that. You know, neither one trusting each other and and not having any chemistry. First meeting was three and a half hours. They were so good with each other, not agreeing with each other, but engaging in those first steps of of body chemistry to see can we get to a place where we can agree on one or two things and they did and that then led to a subsequent meeting three weeks later which got to the next step. So Elshar is leaning in saying I have to I have to appease all my neighbors. I have Israel on one side. I have Turkey on the other. I have the Gulf countries who have expectations of me also. Saudi Arabia, Qatar, UAE. I have Egypt, which is a 10,000 pound gorilla, which also has interests. I have Jordan. I have Iraq going to elections and in dismay themselves that also has a huge population of Kurds. And I'm trying to give everything to everybody. It's a monumentally difficult task for him. So I tell everybody that criticizes me, which they do, by the way. I take criticism from all factions equally. I'm I'm an equally accepting criticism receiver. I say, great. You don't like the president's view of taking sanctions off these guys. You don't like us trying to support them. You don't like me personally trying to mediate a peace or a standown or a security agreement. Give me plan B. I still have energy. I've got the relationships. I'm happy to adapt. I'm happy to run to the president and say, "By the way, we're on the wrong road, Secretary Rubio. I have a brilliant plan B. Let's run." Not one. There's no plan B. Plan B is chaos and a return to worse than what the Assad regime was. So this whole march of the Abraham Accords, which was brilliant, right? I mean, Jared Kushner, when you think about what Jared Kushner and the president did in the first term, and by the way, I I told them at the time because, you know, part of what I got in trouble for was introducing them to the same Gulf States that are now the savior to the region. Because the idea was we have to run to some alignment with Israel. Well, it's easier for small countries that have a monarchy, right? Saudi Arabia is not a small country. It's harder for them. So, they they need to take their time getting it. But MBS is brilliant, young, inspirational. For Tamim, if you had 400 or 500,000, they're well educated. They've had alignment with the West. They understand Iran, Israel. MBZ ran to it, right? MBZ has a small population. He has a a very wise focus on the entire region. So all of a sudden you have these threads running back to Israel which also are supporting everybody else. You know, we have these skirmishes in Sudan and Somalia and I mean it's everybody's reaching in because you have to take all these threads to create a tapestry and it takes time but that's what's happening. So there's no plan B for Syria. We have to support this young man and his team and supply him with the resources to be able to be inclusive, to bring these minorities in, to hold people accountable and responsible, to train his people, and to allow the people on the street, to feel a difference, to to have a life after decades of of civil war. I want to ask you another question that a lot of people in Lebanon and Syria think about is um as I said Israel's intentions and the whole concept of a greater Israel. You've sat down with Prime Minister Netanyahu. You've also sat down with President um how significant is that concern when it comes to the negotiations because this is um a point that Hisbala makes. Hisbal is like look we if we give up our weapons no one will stand up to Israel if they want to enter Lebanon in the future. And then the counterargument to that is like you know Israel's intention is for peace and if hisbalah does not exist in Lebanon then there is no reason for war in Lebanon. What is your message to the Lebanese people about those two different viewpoints? Because that same concern exists in Syria as well. So my my this is my personal view. How great is the concern of that happening? Zero. Zero. Okay. So it's a big Israel being parasitic. Israel being parasitic to either Syria or Lebanon or the idea that Israel is really interested in keeping everybody off balance so that they can have more control and command in my humble opinion just as an individual is ludicrous. And I've spent more time with all of them probably than anybody. It doesn't exist. That's not what's happening. After October 7th, everything changed for the Israelis. That's not what they're just not what they're thinking of now. Now when we talk about Hezbollah and and again I think it's worthwhile if we can stop here and talk about Hezbollah. What is the problem with Hezbollah the the Shia population in in Lebanon today 30% 40% I don't know what it is you no right nobody can give you accurate numbers but Shia are Lebanese and they're as much Lebanese as Marinites or Sunnis or Drews or any other faction. Hezbollah in Lebanon is a political party. It does a great job in supplying all the municipal components to its southern community. And and from the 80s, it was born out of necessity to protect and and harness whatever wrongdoings were coming from the Israelis and and secondarily the Palestinians. It then got into another mode which which was the military aspect and the political aspect started to be confused by the west and as we know the military aspect was being funded by Iran. So over time what happened is America and other western countries looked and said there's no difference. Hezbollah is Hezbollah. It's an Iranian proxy. It's a foreign terrorist organization and it has to go. We America funding Lebanon. By the way, America loves Lebanon. And and people who who criticize me and I'm happy for the criticism. I'm here for only re one reason is my heart, my soul, my family's heart and soul is is Lebanese. My ability to express it is American because America gave me the gift to come from nothing to something. And what we here have to do is it's your generation that's going to change things. It's not the Jurassic Park generation that's been in control here for 50 years with massive corruption. People freak out when I say that. There's nobody in Lebanon who doesn't think this place hasn't been corrupt for five decades. Of course it is. We don't have we we have 110 billion dollars missing. You have 60 billion out of out of a central bank that just vanishes. You have the highest electricity in the world. You have a central government that gives you nothing. There's no water. There's no electricity. There's no power. A laugh is the only communal thing that's there. And yet you have this dedication to the the beautiful Lebanese history and and people in Beirut prosper. But Hezbollah itself is a part of the Lebanese world. So you can't just say we want to disarm Hezbollah. Everybody's armed. You go into any any car, you know, there everybody's carrying a 357 Magnum. Most people have a AK-47s or 50 caliber machine guns at home. I mean, this is not an environment where you're going to disarm small arms. And disarming is not really the issue. The issue is Hezbollah is looking and saying we are we are the last stop for you against Israel and maybe Syria. And after Ela that argument has become even more impacted, right? Because the Lebanese community is saying, "Wow, Israel just blew through the lines. They went all the way to Damascus. They might do that to us. And by the way, if they don't, we have a jihadist who may not love Shia that we're in constant dialogue with on this border boundary. And maybe that's going to happen there. They haven't fired a shot. Hezbollah hasn't fired a shot at Israel or anybody else since the signing of this November 2024 agreement. And in past history, the inside battle with Hezbollah, there's only been one or two. So what's the answer? The answer is you have to have a better solution for the Shia population. Let's forget about Hezbollah for a minute. And going to your very good question about Speaker Barry, I hold the three leaders that you have in unbelievably high regard. And I think it's an opportunity for Lebanon, for all of us to empower them and use them in a manner that hasn't happened for 70 years. And Speaker Barry is a legislative dynamic holdover of another era. But we need him. He is the voice and the power not just to the Imal party, but to the Shia community. We have to listen to him. He has to help us. We have to figure out a path for the south of Lebanon. Disarm them is not the issue. How do we get them to not want to use weapons? How do we get them to rely on laugh? How do we give them another economic prospect other than taking money from Iran? And I can tell you one thing, this president Iran and I have this conversation. I wish, you know, if if the political situation were different that I could sit down with with Hezbel, if they would listen to me and say, "Look, your road is to laugh the Lebanese." And eventually, I know you hate the word Israel. Israel is not your enemy. The US will stand by laugh, help fund them, and Iran is going to be gone. Whether it's today, tomorrow, or the next day, the situation with Iran, the United States, and Israel is not going to sit by and allow them to continue on the path that they're on. It just isn't going to happen. You have path A, path B, path C. I don't know which path, but switch saddles on the horses now while you can to a better life. Not force to have Sunni and Shia laugh disarming or fighting. Laugh laugh as in Lebanese armed forces. Just for the audience, yes, the Lebanese military, we and they've been through a civil war. Nobody wants that again. Nobody wants another thousand boys and girls dead of Lebanese fighting with with Lebanese. It's It's not going to happen. So, I keep chipping away as, you know, I'm like an Uber driver. I'm just I'm just trying to marry one point of view with another point of view and take them to a destination. It may not be the final destination, but at least we're moving someplace. And then from that destination, we can redefine it. And and in Lebanon, you know, to there was there was a scurry today about comments that I made towards the press. I mean, let me let me start with saying I have been the greatest friend. I'm the greatest supporter of the press all over the world. The media here, I I've grown attached to. I understand that the the chaos that exists in in a news frenzy is not unique to Lebanon. It's all over the world. Look what happens at home, you know, with the president and how he's organized things. Or in Alaska with you remember President Putin, everyone was just yelling and President Putin was confused and yelling was and then you see Trump upset on the side. So that's another recent example, right? So, it's not and and look, if I had to do all over again, I wouldn't have used those words and I I wouldn't have been as as quick on the trigger. Why was it that way? We just finished all these meetings. We brought three of the most powerful Congress people. This is the second Kodell. Kodell is the congressional uh uh appearances to these regions. Why is it so important in Lebanon? Is the answer for the Shia is to have a laugh that they trust. It needs more everything. Laugh needs more money. It needs more equipment. It needs better pay for its people. And and the Shia rely on it on the LF. There hasn't been a a program. But we need more money. We need more money for Lebanon. Where does the money come from? It doesn't come from President Trump. President Trump is the bright north star. So he runs the Republican party, which is now Congress, but Congress empowers and appropriates the funds. So, I brought the head of the appropriations committee for the Senate, the head of the ranking member for the Foreign Relations Committee, and a senior member of Congress to have these meetings. And they had a love affair. So, I'm trying to usher the best of Lebanese experiences, right, besides Hamus and Tibuli and and and warm Lebanese hospitality, which they loved. and we walked into this firestorm, which I'm used to, but I'm freaking out saying, "Wow, we just had the greatest experience, and now I've got a little bit of a disaster on my hand because I have three senior US officials who are going to misunderstand the the frenzy that was created. So, you know, I shouldn't have been so quick. You know, animalistic was a word that that I didn't use in a derogatory manner. I'm just saying, can we calm down? Can we find some tolerance, some kindness?" you know, let's be let's be civilized. But it was inappropriate to do when when the media is just doing their job. I understand more than anybody else. These things are complicated and difficult. And it's very rare that they have an opportunity to talk to people who actually are making the decisions. So, they have the illusion that that's me. I should have been more generous with my time and more tolerant myself. I do want to put into context, you know, the president of the United States has said worse things to the press when he's upset. And I think there's um I think people are just sick of politicians always sugar coating how they feel just saying the right thing at the right time. I think you know when you want to be open and just if you're upset you speak in a way that you're upset like President Trump um I think that comes with uh you know saying things that are not polished and I think this is something that should be appreciated in countries where politicians just polish every single word. I I do want to go back Mr. ambassador, something you said earlier about the um worries when it comes to a a greater Israel or some form of greater Israel. That's a just a big issue they have in Lebanon. So, a lot of people in Lebanon would say that, you know, Hezbollah giving up weapons, not only giving because the the from what I understand, the requirement is not to just give weapons to the Lebanese armed forces, is to destroy the Lebanese armed forces. They have to destroy those weapons. They cannot keep them to protect the country. So, a lot of people are saying this just makes Lebanon a lot more vulnerable. Now you said you don't have any concern. Then how would you explain to people that hear things like what Prime Minister Netanyahu said I think a few two weeks ago on I24 about you know having some sort of connection and feeling connected to a greater Israel or even the finance minister smidge being a lot more explicit saying the future of Jerusalem is to expand to Damascus. Similar quotes of people that are more extreme in Israel. Um, what would be your comment to the Lebanese people that hear this and say, "Ambassador, we're fine having one military. The Lebanese armed forces are trusted in Lebanon by most Lebanese, but we worry what would happen if we destroy Hezbollah's capabilities because Hezbollah proved capable in 2006. I agree 100%. I agree with everything you said except for one one fact. the what's on the table at the moment is not for Hezbollah to disarm and give up their arms and have them destroyed. That's that's not a requirement. And your very good question has to be part of a new answer, right? Which is that's not the issue. The issue isn't the weapons. The issue is the utilization of the weapons. So there's a lot of room between those two points of view. But here here's here's how how I view it. And of course I could be wrong. The US point of view, all of our intelligence, all of our backing, the president of the United States, who I think everybody would say you people may like some of the things he says, not like some of the things, but the man has been right on. His instincts have been right on. He's supporting Israel as an engine to peace in the Middle East. Is that the Is that the right answer? Is it the wrong answer? Is it the in between answer? It's the stated answer. So what I try and tell all of the Lebanese is we have to go to a new place. For 50 years we've been on this road, this confessional road of Marinites, Sunnis, Shia, Drews, Melkites, Greek Orthodox, the confessional system. We're going to evaporate as a dinosaur. We're a tiny little I and I say I I say this pleadingly, right? This isn't about surrender. This This is about survival. It is about survival. We will not survive. Your generation and your kids will not survive in this beautiful environment unless we adapt. But the but the road, the greater Israel, we're dealing with politics everywhere. Does Israel have the capacity or the desire to really geographically take over Lebanon? Absolutely. Probably in an afternoon. Why didn't they do it? They have the capacity to do the same thing in Syria. Why didn't they do it? We've had five agreements, but no signed agreements and all with the wrong people. So, you start with Armistice Agreement, which was a real agreement in 1949. Then you start moving up the path. So, we have, you know, the the beginning of of of the Palestinians and then we have a civil war and then we have a war with Hezbollah. Then we have a a maritime alignment and then the tyif agreement tries to solve everything. Then we go back to a series of of sessation of hostility agreements. None of them work because none of them are with the right people. No one wants to deal with Israel. Israel is the enemy. They can't even say the name. And we don't want to deal with Hezbollah. Iran is a big factor no matter what people say. in the in the entire equation. So we have all of these neighbors and now we have Syria weighed in. We have Saudi Arabia and Qatar and the UAE trying to do the right thing. We have Egypt that's in obeyance and we have Iraq that's going through a chaotic restructuring that's so dangerous. So the answer is dialogue. It's not going to work. What's worked in the past, we can kill each other. We can fire on our neighbors. We can be funded by the next funer of terrorist fundamentals that thinks we have a weakness. And what are we going to lose? Here in Lebanon, we have the most geopolitically important spot. We have the only multidisciplinary, multi-religious historic spot in the world, which is really of value, right? to have this little enclave where you can still have every fact of Muslims and Christians and and eventually Jews living side by side again. That's something. But we have to adapt. We've got to get rid of this anxiety from the past. Use the US is sitting here saying we will help but expectations of the future have got to be defined. And it's not the fear of Israel that it's trust. Israel doesn't trust Hezbollah. Hezbollah doesn't trust Israel. The Hezbollah doesn't trust Laugh because Laugh doesn't have the ability yet to to fill that spot. And the politicians are all shifting. But you have some reformists in place that have the right idea. It's changing. But we all have to weigh in. A difficult question I'm going to add to this. First side, your statement that you think Israel's intention that there's zero possibility or likelihood that Israel wants to, you know, invade more territory in Lebanon or Syria. That is not their intention. They want peace on those borders. But wait, wait a second. I didn't that isn't what I said. Oh, please correct me. I apologize. I said they don't want to take over Lebanon or Syria. That's a that's a difference. Take over. I understand. I understand. So, but do you think there is a risk they might want to take over some additional territory? Number one. And number two, what happens to the existing territory south of the Latani River where Israel is still certain territory that Israel is still there. They've even um um expanded their presence post the ceasefire agreement. Their reasoning is that you know to avoid Hezbollah expanding in the region. Um and obviously um the territory in Syria that there's been reports there is some sort of agreement there for for Israel to pull out. On Lebanon though is a bit more vague. Israel said I I don't remember the exact quote. I'm sure you spoke to Natao, you know, the his intentions more than anyone, but in public the his office said that Israel's planning to work with Lebanon um and assist Lebanon. I think that's the word he used. So, I'm just curious to see what you think they mean. So, they said uh stand for st stand ready to support Lebanon. That was their word from Natano's office. So, my question to you is what happens to the territory where Israel's exists right now, Lebanese and Syrian territory? Okay, princ let me tell you net Netanyahu my impression again just my impression I I spent almost two hours with him my argument was a personal one I was saying talking about Gaza is way over my pay grade you're talking to the president of the United States and Steve Wickoff who are secretary Rubio you have the three most important people in the world to talk to about that. I come from your region. I I I have Lebanese blood and I'm asking you to do something that I know will do you well and do Jews all over the world well. Give Lebanon a break. Give them a whiff of tolerance and understanding. You can't be apparently so brutal on everybody of going anywhere anytime you want without rationale. It's going to backfire eventually and you need support teams around you and you could have Lebanon easily. give up the idea if you think that there's cells moving or that things are building or that there's an indeterminable process or attack that's going to take place. If you give them 30 days, give us 30 days, 45 days so that we can go back to the Shia and say, "Okay, we've got something for you now. We're going to stop and we have the economic program that you're talking about, which I'll come back to. You're not going to lose anything." but ju just be the perfume of tolerance and understanding so that they know you're not piric on them. And he agreed. I was amazed. By the way, he's a real guy. He doesn't He just said, "You may like it or not like it, but he just lays it out exactly the way it is. As does Ron Durmer, as does the Minister of Defense. You don't like everything they say. I wasn't happy about everything they said, but I understood it." Versus the edges in other places where you you know what you're hearing is not not what's happening these lines. So just to to the viewing community these lines it's it's I mean you're talking about sometimes two kilometers or four kilometers. So it's what size pen drew the blue line and the green line and the red line. You could lose your mind over this honestly but people are losing lives over this which again to me is amazement. Who cares? It's not about the line. Sovereignty is not that sovereignty is the heart and soul of the people. We're gonna lose lines over an argument of two kilometers of ways. We talk about the Sheba farms. I mean, I went to the the Israelis took me to the Sha Farms. I've heard about Sheba Farms. It's a big issue for Syria, Lebanon, Israel. So, I'm massively, you know, ignorant on the geography. So, I have them take me there. Honestly, in my mind, I thought I'm going to see a Kentucky white fence thoroughbred farm. This has got to be one of the most amazing, unbelievable farms in the world. It's empty. It's mountainous. It's rocky. It's worthless. It just happens to be geographically important to see line of sight. You don't need line of sight anymore. They have technology for everything. Israel knows everything that's moving every minute. The combined intelligence all over the world know what you and I are talking about before this call, after this call, right? It it's it's ridiculous to say we're going to lose lines or lose lives over lines. That's not the issue. The issue is exactly what you're talking about. How do you get back to an understanding of allowing each other to live successfully and prosperously with each other regardless of what the religion or the nationality is? It takes conversation. It takes dialogue. It takes commitment. It it takes leaders who are saying put all this behind us. I'm not going to argue about whether it's the 67 line, the 74 line, but the Sinai agreement between Israel and Egypt took four and a half years to negotiate. Four and a half years. Henry Kissinger, probably the the the best paygrade diplomat in in the world, right? I should be carrying his shoes around. Four and a half years. But it was a utilization agreement. So Egypt kept the land. It was about what happens inside. Now, the Egyptians and and and the Israelis still don't like each other, right? They're not they're not talking to each other, cooperating, which is the other problem. Egypt has to have prosperity itself. So, I look at the next process as saying, give it up. I'm not going to sp I'll tell you one thing at this point in my life. I am not going to spend my life in geography defining was the blue line done with a Sharpie or was the blue line done with a ballpoint pen. That's the difference. two kilometers thick pen small pen you want to lose your son's life over this that's not the issue so it's ushering everybody to a new way of thinking of of g getting over the the tribal rage of disrespect I mean what I've found I mean if you were to ask me besides all the things that I don't know and and what an amazing education and how privileged I am to have the ability to be with these great minds and great people and and and great countries. What is it all about? Respect. Just like with Hezbollah, you can't disarm. There's there's not going to be a laugh military movement to go blow them away. There just won't be. So, we can we can talk about it. We can ask for it. I know that that's not going to happen. What we have to do is engineer a way for the Shia to find relevance, respect, and save face in this process of not being forced to do something that appears to be inongruent to them and that hurts their their their personal relationship. It's the same with Syria with the Drews. The Drews and Bedawins have lived side by side for hundreds of years, but the Bedawins were there first, right? I mean, this is honestly the conversation. When this conversation started, I thought I thought they're they must be talking about October and November. They're talking about 300 years ago. No, it's it's mindboggling. So, you're you're sitting with Drew Shakes and Bedawin leaders and we're really going back to that. Who occupied this 300 years ago? And I asked a stupid question to the Bedwins. I said, "Well, weren't bedawins bedawins? How do I mean are you entitled to this property when you're moving across vast lands or so many scars. So many scars. Yes. It's it's so complicated and difficult. Um, I I I have another question that's I think the most difficult. Would you know the US removed the bounty on the Syrian president when he became president not long afterwards to open up the door for um, you know, diplomatic ties and some sort of peace agreement and normalization in the region. Now, Hezbollah is still designated as a terrorist organization. Has there been any discussion about removing that designation as part of the negotiations and disarmament of Hezbollah so Hzbalah could become a legitimate political faction and not being labeled as a terrorist organization for the sake of peace? It's it's such a great issue and it's a great suggestion. So let me tell you why it hasn't happened, right? Is you you you see the scuffle we're in with Iran. So the proxies Hezbollah Hamas Houthis have been the target and Hezbollah with American blood puts them off base to have a discussion until Iran and Hezbollah came to America. Came to America meaning having a discussion again it it has to happen and I think it would happen. Again, the confusion is Hezbollah is separated from Shi or Amal separated from the the Hezbollah party should be having that discussion. What do you need right from America? And by the way, we're we're having this because I'm asking every day I said, "Use me. Maybe my useful life is another few months, right, until the president fires me for not getting anything done. Use me. What is it that you want? Tell me what you want. Let me help you get there. Just give me the package. But don't give me 150 complaints about what's happened since 1972 or since your formation in 1983 or since the 2006 war. Tell me the three things you need today that'll change the situation to make you unwind from Iran. look at me as your proxy to go to Lebanon, to go to the US and our donor partners and say, "Okay, we need a living in the south right now." Let me just give you the numbers. And this is I'm a finance guy, but I don't know the exact numbers, and this isn't classified. This is what I think is you have Hezbollah soldiers, military reserves and non-reserves probably 20,000 of each, 40,000. Let's say they make $700 a month. By the way, laugh soldiers in Lebanon make 275 or $300 a month. So the the laugh soldier has right has to work as a soldier, a barista, and an Uber driver to make a living. And then we say, "Oh, right." Then we say, "Oh, by the way, this bright young Sunni boy or girl, we want you to go knock on the door of your cousin who lives in the south and tell them you're going to go take the guns out of their basement." And if they don't like it, tell them you're going to enforce that. It's not, it's just not going to happen. So you have Hezel. So if you take those numbers, maybe that's $37 million a month. Now they have power. They have water, they have utilities, they have trash pickup, and they have a security system. How much is that? Let's just say we're on an economy binge and that's another 20 million a month. So you you have 60 million a month coming from somewhere. So how can you walk in and say, "By the way, we want you to distance yourself from Iran." And in addition to being lost and losing face, you're not going to be able to make a living. Not going to work. So we have donor states who are coming in and we have to package the way that you're thinking about it of saying we can substitute. We can be the substitute for Iran. We don't want you to be aggressive or parasitic on anybody. And you can mold into laugh. You're Lebanese. Hezbollah fine. Hezbollah is going to be a real political party. You want to be military. Laugh is your wrote. They're recruiting your experienced surgical warriors. Come in to laugh. That takes a discussion. We can't get to a discussion. Were they were they were they open was open to this about integrating into the Lebanese armed forces and in Lebanese economy with support from other Arab countries trying to offer that alternative to Iranian funds? In in fairness, I don't know because I haven't been able to speak to them directly and as best I know, nobody has had that conversation with them. That should be at an appropriate political level. That should be the conver to me. That's the conversation is it's not through weapons. It's it's through carrots and the stick is if that doesn't happen, eventually you're going to lose your relevance. Not not because the US is threatening anything. We're not. This is a this is a Lebanese issue, but eventually one way or the other, it's going to evaporate. So utilize utilize this moment. Look, Iran is on its heel. And we love the Iranian people. When I when I talk about these countries, the sad thing is I mean this is isolated leadership everywhere, right? It's just it's just corrupt men who have their own purpose in life and the people suffer. The Iranian people are amongst the smartest, most sophisticated, most educated blend with us, right? Forever they have. But having that discussion with them, there's lots of other discussions going on. Somebody has to bridge that first gap. And we haven't done it. I haven't done it on behalf of the president. I don't think the Lebanese administration has done it yet. Quite honestly, President Aun and your prime minister have been heroic in what they've accomplished so far. And my belief is Speaker Barry along with them is coming on side and is really a key component of how do we usher the Shia population to success? Not how do we embarrass them, not how do we brutalize them or threaten them. I understand the political idea of saying we have to expunge Hezbollah, but we have to find a more a more understanding on-ramp as how to do that. So then what do you think of Iran, the assistant commander of the Kutzfor saying the Hisbala disarmment plan in Lebanon is an American Zionist plan that will never be implemented. He continues to say how Hisbala will never disarm. Um is that aligned with Hisbala's stance because Hisbala's comments were a bit different. There seems to be a path to disarmament and we've seen the two deviate a lot over the last few months as Israel pounded than pounded Iran. It seems that at least in my view I want to get your thoughts on it. Hezbollah is becoming less and less influenced by Iran or in what I would like to say is like less of an Iranian proxy and more of a a Lebanese political party. Would you agree with that with that view? I do. I I I hope so. It's, you know, it's happening in inches and meters instead of miles and kilometers, but it but it's happening and and in a non-adversary I I don't you know, again, the Iranian people, I I hope that they find their own path. But there's no question that the Shia and Hezbollah are looking and saying the days of these statements being made by Iranian leaders, which is the more they make and the more they attack me and the more they attack everybody, the weaker they are. They wouldn't waste their time if they were really empowered. This is a moment the president of the United States aligned with Israel has put them on their back foot. They've never been weaker than they are at the moment. I mean, when you when you overfly and have B2 bombers dropping surgically bombs into the bowels of what their nuclear operations are without any collateral damage and saying, "By the way, that was an appetizer. So, if you want to mess with us, just be sure this is what you're going to have. We moved half of our fleets into the Mediterranean. So when you want to talk about power and you have the most peaceful, prosperous president of the United States we've ever had. He really is. He also runs out of patience quickly when he's disrespected. his goal for Lebanon, for Syria, for Israel, for the Gulf countries, for Egypt, for Turkey, for the northern caucuses is regional hegeim economic prosperity. If that doesn't happen, if it's not cooperative within this time frame of all of these incidents happening, everybody's tired of war. Gaza and Israel, world is worn out. Ukraine and Russia, the world is worn out. China threatening Taiwan, the world is run out. What's happening in Venezuela? What's happening in Brazil? What's happening in Colombia? There's just too many things. We need to grab this opportunity. When I say we, Lebanon, Syria, Turkey, Turkeyy's been a a fantastic ally. Turkey also is misunderstood, right? It's our largest NATO ally. It's always perceived to be non-Arab Islamic country that supports the Muslim Brotherhood. Again, in my opinion, it doesn't support the Muslim Brotherhood. Muslim Brotherhood happens to be an aligned entity that because it's a republic has freedom within its environment, but they have been a staunch friend and ally of ours through everything and the biggest contributor to NATO besides ourselves. But again, it's confused. So you have the Kurds that have been at war, 40,000 lives lost in in Turkeykey's road to its own new independence which is non-Arab and this realignment of saying okay how now do we bring peace and a buffer to that border for Syria. So that's an ongoing discussion but it's happening. So Muslim and SDF who represent that faction and Akan Fidan and and Ibrahim Colin who are the the proxies for President Erdogan and addressing this are acting responsibly right we have we have dialogue but we need dialogue then so another question I have is um what are the obstacles you're facing and not only within the Middle East but also domestically it seems there's a lot of resistance because what you're doing is hasn't been done in in know since I don't know when how many decades ago. So my first question is what what would be the biggest challenges you face in your meetings with Prime Minister Netanyahu, Prime Minister of Israel, President of Syria, President of Lebanon, the representatives on the Hzbala side, not direct Hezbala representatives. Um was there any instances where you kind of got a bit heated? Not sure what you could share or there was significant areas of disagreement. Um that would be the first question. Next question is I want to talk about some of the resistance you faced even domestically surprisingly to the efforts. It's a great question. So the the biggest elements of of resistance are my own inability to understand all the counterveilling issues that they're all dealing with. Right? So, I'm looking at a linear path and saying I'm I'm here to help you on behalf of the president of the United States drive down this destination from point A to point D. What I don't know is they have a Rubik's cube of destinations that they're working on that compromise my ability to take them down this road and they're not transparent with me. I can be 100% transparent with them because my job is this thin, right? I know I I'm empowered to get this thing done, but I don't know all the things that are going on around them. And remember, all these people come out of a mostly some military or intelligence background. So, they trust nobody. So, the first thing that I need to do is get them to trust me. Get them to trust me. And just that I'm telling them the truth, whatever. They may not like what I say, but the power ability comes from America and this president. I haven't had I haven't had a an argument with any of them. I've had many discussions in which we disagree all the time. But what I found them, if they can deal with me, they can deal with each other. It's just getting rid of the regrets of the the regrets of the past don't mean anything, right? It's not taking us anywhere. I mean, you jumped ahead. This the form that we're in now is like saying, let's go back to using toin coin operated pay telephones, right? You don't have to worry anymore about radio cell towers or telephone phone lines or or reporters walking to a room with with traditional distribution. You jump to another place. We need to do the same thing. We need to use that model and jump to the next place. It's your generation that's going to do it because a lot of us are trapped in you never get out of this frame of mind of the regrets of the past. That's a very good point. Like a lot of the younger generation obviously I travel around the world you see in for people in Lebanon you see Lebanese and Israelis work together you know when I go to any music festival they dance together have fun like any other two people. I remember when I was in um I took my partner to Tomorrowland just a few weeks ago and I was one one interesting observation the two flags that were the most prevalent everywhere and they were next to each other dancing together were the Palestinian flag and the Israeli flag and the third or the fourth most common one I was counting them was the Lebanese flag. So, it's just fascinating to see those flags that are just fighting and not able to talk to each other. When you go outside this region, which is kind of controlled by these politicians that live in the past, what we call Jurassic Park um that have a lot of scars and I don't want to diminish their scars. They've been through a lot. These wars take a toll on everyone and they don't trust each other. As you said, every leader, Prime Minister Netanyah, I think, was special forces. President was the military was I think he's a general in the in the Lebanese military. um president of Syria was was uh part of the the the uh military sect and initially part of uh I think it was al-Qaeda. So they don't trust each other. They fought against each other. Um but outside the that region there is dialogue, there is peace and I think we need to bring that same sentiment to Lebanon, to Israel, to Syria um and the rest of the region. What about domestic resistance that you faced Mr. Ambassador? Um how has how has you know kind of been the sentiment like in the US? been significant support. Was there any voices that were trying to kind of discredit what you're doing? We should be a shame if that's the case. Um, yeah. The good the good thing is I have three bosses, President of the United States, the Secretary of State, and America in general. So, I don't listen to the noise. You know, I've been through enough that I admire people's points of view. I know everybody is doing the best they can and and trying to lobby for their own personal point of view and I listen to them. And believe me, there's lots of people who think that America spending any time in the Middle East is a total waste of time, effort, money, and America is the most beautiful country in the world. and and the people have the the the kindest perspective, but sometimes the knowledge on an international basis gets confused. So, one thing that that the Middle East does horribly and that Arabs do particularly bad is representing themselves to that public, to the American public in in a proper way. Israel does it much better. Israel has a very organized lobbying group. You know, Jews stick together. I grew up in a Jewish neighborhood, so I went to Shabbat every Friday night. I'm a Marinite Catholic. But it was it was beautiful, right? I I I loved it. They and they stick together and they do business together. What happens to us? I mean, first of all, there's no Lebanese uh Turkish refugees. They leave and they go to work someplace. So you don't see Lebanese on the street begging in some other country. They leave. They've been persecuted. They go and they find a desert and within three years it becomes a a freaking oasis, right? This the same with the Turks. So and that's how Americans relate to those those countries. So Saudi Arabia and Qatar, UAE had a little more difficult problem because they had monarchies that weren't based on on working populations going to other places as a colony and integrating in that colony. They were non-integrated. They had the benefit and the blessing of fossil fuel revenues. So they didn't have to do that. But as a consequence, it's misunderstood. They're the kindest, most hospitable, uncorrupted people. We have all these conspira conspiracy theories. Every time Qatar goes to help us, somebody has a conspiracy theory that they're working against us. That's not true. You have these young leaders NBS and Tamim and Qatar and Saudi Arabia. They're turning the they're turning an aircraft carrier. We talk about points of view. You know, you you've had these conservative Islamic countries that are just are this vision 2030 and what happens with with Qatar and the World Cup. It's it's amazing what they've done. But the other big countries with all the populations and no oil revenue, what happens, right? What's what's it what's at the basis? How how do you change it? So, the American public is looking and saying, "What's the endgame?" I have this I have this conversation with my friends all the time saying so what's the endgame? What what are you what you know what are you trying to do? It's never in 5,000 years you've never had peace in this region. You think President Trump is going to be the guy who actually does it? I'd say you know actually I do. I I really do because we're we're at a moment of crisis everywhere and we have we have the threads of prosperity that can be the answer by bubbling it up from the bottom. But that's what we have to concentrate on. So I I try and explain as best I can. We we have a brilliant Secretary of State. You know, Secretary Rubio, I I have to say, is one of the safest hands anywhere in the world. He takes the vision of President Trump who's instinctively like this, but he applies it across the board in a way that I'm I'm in such admiration because he's also the national security head. So those two jobs only existed one other time in history, which was Henry Kissinger. So he's the highest adviser, personal adviser to the president on all security issues and he runs one of the of of the biggest foreign uh policy operations in the world simultaneously. But the message is so complicated. We have to start by saving ourselves. It has to start with Lebanon saving Lebanon. Syria saving Syria. Turkey saving Turkey. The Gulf States are doing their thing, right? They're chipping in. By the way, without them, there's no future for Syria. There's no there's nobody to fund it, right? They they have to step in and help. Just like with Lebanon, they need Iran. Exactly. Like, if being funded by Iran and and that's cut off, if you want to, you know, remove Iranian influence in Lebanon, then someone needs to fill that void, as you said earlier. Like, I think you're making very pragmatic points. As much as it bothers people to hear those things being said, you know, it's just you can't, you know, it's just logic. As much as it bothers people, that's just logic. You got to to solve these problems, you got to go up with practical solutions. But then if we do solve these problems, tell the Lebanese people, the Syrian people, the Israelis listening to this. Um, how would So what happens now? Let's say Hezbollah Israel fills their side of the bargain. They begin pulling out. And my question to you is, is there intention to really pull out completely from Lebanon or we don't know yet. If you can clarify that because they're a bit vague. Um what your personal opinion is because you obviously can't speak on their behalf. Do you think they will pull out completely from Lebanon? And if they do then and Hezbollah Assams, what happens next in Lebanon? What do you envisionage for Lebanon? What do you envisionage for Syria that's just so fractured right now? Um just so people can imagine how the Middle East could look like if this succeeds. So if you if you take a chapter out of the president Jared Kushner's view of the Abraham Accords, which by the way, I I have such great admiration for Jared. I've known him since he he married Ivanka. When he when he when he shared that idea with me, I said, "You are out of your mind. you really think you're you're you're going to get the UAE and Israel to agree on anything while this Palestinian issue is booming? He said, "Yeah, I think we can get there." So, he got there. So if you think about the power of if you took the broader Levant where you have oil. So you have oil in Iraq, you have oil in Israel, you have oil in Syria, you have the hardest working industrious diverse people in Turkey. You have Lebanon, which there's nobody in the world when they talk about Lebanon who says, you know, the smartest, the richest, the most bright person in my community happens to be Lebanese. We do amazing outside of Lebanon, everywhere in the world, right? The top 10 success, forget about money. money for sure. But if you take every other silo of achievement, education, medicine, art, music, there's some Lebanese and the top 10 of every so that is the biggest resource to the rest of the region, right? Egypt has worker bees. Syria has the most industri industrious trade people. You want to learn what life is like, you go to the bizaar, right? They have these halal systems. They don't have a central bank or a correspondent banking system, but they can send $5,000 to Dubai like magic, right? Through this barter system. So if you marry those and now you have gas pipelines, you you take a place you have Azer vjan and Armenia. Who ever thought this was going to happen? On this president's watch, you have 32 miles of this crazy pass that they've been killing each other for centuries over. Boom. It opens up. So now what happens? Azeran which is a gas and mineralrich but hasn't been able to really create the pipelines the way they wanted to to Europe. Armenia who has had this difficulty with Turkey for 100 years now opens up the border. Trade starts flowing everywhere. So you have the money from the Gulf. You have the industriousness from the hardest working people in the Levant. You have the finance capital. What's the only problem with Dubai? By the way, I love Dubai. been partners with them in my previous life for 40 years. I have such admiration for them. What's the problem with Dubai? You go, you have the most beautiful hotels, the most incredible golf courses, the most beautiful men and women, you have alcohol, you're going to have gaming, you have everything. What's the problem is you go to a great hotel and you have an Italian cappuccino machine and you have beans that are coming in from Colombia and you have the best water from Finland and you're in the Arab world and you're being served by a Sichelian or by an Indian or by a Filipino and you're the beauty of it is the blank canvas of what it is the beautiful culture that the founding of those countries brought which are young. They're babies, right? They weren't brought into existence until really the the 60s for this touristic model. Lebanon was the heart. It's the it's the it's the shining north star of an ancient hospitality and civilization that people lusted over. I mean, before you were born, when I first came to Lebanon, which is when I found myself, you I was a young lawyer. I must have been the the worst young lawyer as I as I told you. They sent me to Saudi Arabia, but you could only go, you had to get on Panama Airlines, I'll never forget, $3,500, which my law firm was paying for, and you had three stops in order to get into Saudi Arabia, which was ultimately TWWA and Panm. One of the stops was Beirut. I stop. I'm 23 years old. I'm so excited. I get out. Cabs in those days were Mercedes. You have eight people in a Mercedes. There's no such thing as a cab. And there was one hotel and that was the Phoenician and the St. George at that time were were really the hotels. I didn't have a hotel reservation. I didn't know where I was going. I hop in this Mercedes with five other people. Driver looks at me and Arabic says, "Yeah, you're Lebanese, aren't you?" And I said, "No, I I am." He said, "But why aren't you speaking Arabic?" I said, "Because I speak a dialect that's 90 years old. It's my my grandparents dialect because my parents only spoke Arabic." He starts yelling and screaming at me. He says, 'I'm going to take you to this hotel. I'm going to find you a place to stay and I'm going to pick you up tomorrow morning and take you to Z, your father's village. I said, 'But I don't know anybody there. This is Lebanon. He takes me to the Phoenicia hotel. There's no rooms. He tells the manager where I'm coming from. The manager says, "The chef is gone tonight. You can sleep in the kitchen in his bed." Picks me up the next morning, drives me to Zahi within two hours. And I had always heard my father and my grandfather talk about the Berdowni River. To your viewing population, they talk about the Verdown River in Zucki, which is in the mountains like the Grand Canyon. It's the winter. I drive and it's barely a trickle. There's nothing in it. I'm going, "My god, this is this is where I came from. This is what it is." We get to this beautiful restaurant, go to the restaurant, ask me, "What's your father's name? What's your grandfather's name? What was your mother's name? Where did it come from?" And in 40 minutes there's 200 people. I promise you I didn't leave for a week. And I found myself. I found myself. When people say what is your destiny besides luck for all of us, right? It's luck. I mean if you look at the great career that you created at a very young age, you can you can name the three times the three events where destiny met preparation and it happened. For me that thunderbolt was here. It it was I found myself here. You have 22 million 23 million diaspora Lebanese outside of Lebanon. All want to come back and find it. 23. Wow. All dying to have an experience. What do they need to have that experience? Number one, security. They're terrified. Number two, stability. Number three, a transparent system. Number four, enterprise. How do you get sorry on that first point you made ambassador how do you get that security that's an important a concern that the Lebanese have if no longer there and they some of them see his offering security for the country from the enemy enemy in their eyes Israel Senator Graeme said I envision as a US senator one day the relationship between Lebanon and the US maturing to the point that we would have a mutual defense agreement is there any discussions of a potential security guarantee from the US like what we're discussing in Ukraine and Europe. Yes. Maybe even easier and quicker. If you remember in the Eisenhower area in the 50s, we had a kind of security agreement, right? The Marines landed here to take care of of the Lebanese. I think the steps of that are yes, it can happen. And to have Senator Graham say that was not, you know, he he is not a man that says things that he doesn't believe as you know. That was huge. How do you get there? You start with with the Lebanese armed forces. The way to get everybody comfortable is to empower laugh which everybody trusts right across the realm even Syria and Israel right because I'm privileged to have the conversations with all of them. laugh never comes into harm in those conversations and it's it's it's a level of trust and it's being driven by American troops in this mechanism that that cooperate with each other. So the first road is empower lab. Give them more resources. Give them more people. Give them more training. Give them more money. As in the US giving them military equipment. Just to be clear. US supplying military to US. Yes. US giving them money, military equipment and training. And the other donor states are doing the same. Jordan is giving, by the way, they're living on 60-y old equipment. And let them right now. They they are they're they're the cook, the doctor, the fireman, the soldier. They do all they do everything and everybody trusts them. The Shia trust them. So empower them is the first step to security. They can do it. Solidify the ports. You have a great new transportation minister in in in Lebanon who who's done a great job. Now you have scanners at at the airport. It's going to happen to the ports in Beirut. have to do the same thing in Tripoli, but it'll happen as soon as you start doing that. So, the banking resolution, I don't want to get complicated because the viewers are going to get tired of of listening to me on these, but every Lebanese diaspora around the world in the 70s and 80s was sending money to Lebanon. Everyone. Now, we had a banking disaster. And I don't want to get into what what that was. The Lebanese all over the world are wealthy. They're cashri. They all have relatives here and it has a history of banking and finance that is irreparable, but it's been injured. It's like regrets of the past, right? So, the banking system went bust. It has to be navigated back to health. But that happens all over the world. It happened in in 1989 in America, then 1994 in France and England, 1997 in in Asia. It just continues on, right? These banking collapses. So we can get over that. But once you get over that, if you have laugh security, who are you worried about inside? If if if if the Hezbollah faction is on side and now we have one Lebanon, they live side by side forever. the Sunnis, the Shi, the confessional system, the French mandate, the Tarif agreement, whatever it is, that will change, right? Your generation is going to come and say, "Look, I don't care whether they're Sunnis or Shia or it's I want the best person for the job." Right? La last question, probably the most difficult, Mr. Ambassador, is u there's a lot of people in Lebanon fearing what's happened before. We had a wave of political assassinations about whatever 20 years ago now. Um, and Lebanon has been through decades and decades and decades of civil war and everyone's still worried to this day this could happen again. And I think hinted one of their responses, the leader um said that there'll be no life in Lebanon. Again, vague comment um if the state tries to force a disarmament. How worried are you that if this doesn't go well for whatever reason, Lebanon could again descend into civil war? How high is that risk or how low is that risk? So again, I'm going to I'm going to give you a copout answer because I'm going to give you my own personal view. Um I don't want to see that happen. I think in the risk envelope besides what outside countries may want to force Lebanon into to to disengage from Iranian, right? The way the outside world looks, it says Iran, Iran is the enemy and a terrorist organization. Hezbollah is a terrorist organization. They have to be gone. What does that mean? The Western world isn't isn't at the level that we are, right? They're just saying they want it gone. Now, the reality is you're not going to sacrifice thousands of Lebanese lives again in a civil war. Nobody wants that. So, what what President Trump is proposing is something different. is saying fine, we'll bring donor states to the south. Israel needs a buffer zone. Right? Israel is said, what's Israel's worry is October 7th caught them by surprise. So what are they really worried about south of Latani? They think those are launching areas for missiles, rockets, drones. They don't want that to happen. So forget about a border discussion. We need a utilization discussion as to what's good for Hezbollah is there that they don't need to utilize the arms. Who who do they need those arms for? They're not going to fire on Laugh. I think it's clear they're not they don't want a war with Laugh and Laugh doesn't want a war with them. So if you take Israel out of the equation, what how do you get them out of the equation? My humble view is the president's president of the United States view is a negotiated buffer zone of economic prosperity for the south is is the answer and that will take a little bit of time. So then why does anybody need to be armed if Hezbollah then rolls into LA? If if you have that trust and confidence, which I think you do now, you have you have a government to me today, the leaders and the new ministers seem to be non-corrupt. And I say that from a factual point of view is there's no there's there's nobody disputes the fact that traditionally for the last four decades, the government has collapsed and you've had a corrupt regime that has lived off of their own resources, which has hindered the people. If that's gone, which it is gone now, you're you you have a new program moving forward. You get rid of the Israeli threat, which takes trust in that buffer zone, and Hezbollah has to buy into it. You give them a new donor, not Iran, but the donor countries building a self-sustained economy, not only for them, but for the rest of Lebanon. and you have laugh as a security guarantor that's backed by us and all the other donor states that want to see it happen. To me, that's the answer. Then you bring back your generation, the next generation, those 22 million Lebanese outside who will bring capital, industry, enterprise, businesses because they they want to find that that bit of Hanoon that they left and they would have security and they have an ancient civilization to do with. The fact that Dubai is a thousand miles ahead in technology is not the fact they can compete. We Dubai has to buy Lebanese to make it work. Right? If you if if you look all over the Middle East, who's running the financial operations? Who's running the banks? Who's running the governments? Who who's running the mergers, the acquisitions, the consulting groups? We farm it out. We're exporting the best resource we have, which is the Lebanese boys and girls, and we need to educate them. We need to train them. And we need to get rid of this. Are you a Sunni? Are you a Shia? Are you a Marinite? Are you a Greek Orthodox? It's I think it can happen. And I'm I'm hopeful. I think the the Levant region can be resurrected for the stature and respect that it deserves. Mr. Ambassador, I think your the task ahead of you is monumental and I'm surprised you've progressed this far in such a short period of time. The fact that you've been able to speak to all those leaders and find common ground is beautiful, perplexing, but beautiful. Congratulations on that. And I think if you succeed to do what many considered impossible, um it's an incredible legacy to leave behind. So I wish you all the all the best. And I also would like to thank you for being so sincere in this discussion because you are disc, you know, we're discussing things that are extremely sensitive, politically charged. There's things in Lebanon, in Syria, Israel less so that you literally cannot say even now in Israel after October 7th, there's a lot of trauma and pain there, but you cannot say those things. There's things in Lebanon, you get arrested for speaking about Israel or speaking to Israelis in Lebanon. I'm not sure if Syria is the same. And then there's all these different sects that fight each other all the time. They've killed each other even recently um you know two decades ago. So for you to be so sincere about it while you're in the middle of these discussions and sit down with me for an hour and a half is uh is incredible and I think that's what the region need. That's my personal opinion but that's what the region needs. That level of sincerity and kind of directness that you have. So I sincerely wish you all the best for the sake of everyone in the region beyond Lebanon, Syria, Israel, Iran, Turkey, just for the rest of the countries as well. Um hopefully you succeed and again thank you so much for your time, sir. No, thank you and and thank you for everything that you're doing because without without these broad channels of communication for every point of view that can bypass the orientation of the the traditional way in which points of view get disseminated, we're all lost. So, you're speedating to that that program. And like I said, I I'm thankful to the to my president, Secretary of State, who allow me the privilege and the opportunity to do the one thing that they advise me not to do. Don't screw it up. I'm sure you won't. Thank you, sir. I appreciate it. Thank you.